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msmobiles.com_robot
Joined: 23 Mar 2004
Posts: 16777215
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 Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 2:37 pm Post subject: Palm Pre |
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You might have read that Palm's stock soared over 35% this week. What's the excitement about? It's about the Pre smartphone, which is one of the most searched terms on Google today (according to Palm).
Read more at http://www.msmobiles.com/news.php/7955.html |
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Stoic33
Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:25 pm Post subject: |
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Agree: I think Palm did a superb job with the Pre, it isn’t perfect but its certainly a step in the right direction..
Nb. Has anyone else noticed the similarity between the ‘Cards’ view for multi-tasking between applications
and the MS/Nvidia Tegra cards home screen that was demoed last year. I wonder if MS was also going to
adopt a similar cards UI approach?
With user-interface concepts as Multi-touch, Gesture Area and Cards view ..etc all being showcased. MS
will have to pull a huge rabbit out of their bag to showcase something as compelling on their platform
and not just a cheap imitation, if their hoping to get back in the game..
Targra cards: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=lKcqBAPhDc0&feature=related |
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Hobo
Joined: 23 Nov 2008
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Has it got an App Store? |
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netboy
Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 349
Location: Bayarea, CA USA
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:48 pm Post subject: Re: Palm Pre |
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| msmobiles.com_robot wrote: | You might have read that Palm's stock soared over 35% this week. What's the excitement about? It's about the Pre smartphone, which is one of the most searched terms on Google today (according to Palm).
Read more at http://www.msmobiles.com/news.php/7955.html |
stocks is just a game! u buy, they sell! haha
Palm Pre with that low a@# resolutions doesnt impress me!
if i want a low a@# resolutions, i will get iphone, no need to get iphone clone! haha |
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EJR
Joined: 18 Mar 2004
Posts: 2629
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Hobo wrote: | | Has it got an App Store? |
yes, sir, they call it app catalog
| Stoic33 wrote: |
With user-interface concepts as Multi-touch, Gesture Area and Cards view ..etc all being showcased. MS
will have to pull a huge rabbit out of their bag to showcase something as compelling on their platform
and not just a cheap imitation, if their hoping to get back in the game..
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I agree, Palm Pre means that now Microsoft must deliver in Windows Mobile: a) multi-touch, b) app store |
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cellneuron
Joined: 28 Mar 2007
Posts: 22
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Why app store is so important? I didn't get it. Want a third party app? Go to pocketgear and buy one. |
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alcedes
Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 273
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
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| Posted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| cellneuron wrote: | | Why app store is so important? Want a third party app? Go to pocketgear and buy one. |
Not all users may be aware of third party stores. The presence of the store reference on the device better ensures that users are aware that they can get thirs party apps and that they know where to get them.
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MCAD .Net , MCTS (Web, Windows) |
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JNGold
Joined: 27 Oct 2005
Posts: 116
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| Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 1:25 am Post subject: |
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I am very impressed with the Pre thusfar. In a short time, it has become the top on my short list (when it comes to US GSM) to finally replace my long line of WM devices.
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JNGold
PDA Lineage:
Visor, Visor Prism, Casio EM-500, Casio E-200, HP Jornada 568, IPAQ 1910,IPAQ 4150,Ipaq 2750, Imate K-JAM,Treo 750,HTC Touch Cruise,US Touch Diamond,iPhone 3G,iPhone 3GS |
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kieranEire
Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 282
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| Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:51 am Post subject: |
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If a windows mobile user wants an application he can find it. The problem with the app store certainly on the iphone is that it gives Apple complete control what goes onto an iphone which is good as far a device stability goes it can be misused to control the market. As long application stability and conformance to basic performance standards are the only requirements to be listed on the app store this is great. Though if the app store is misused, destroying competition and giving preference to certain developers. I do not like this type of application managed by the likes of Apple or Microsoft etc.
As for the Palm Pre, it looks fantastic. The small screen while many see this as an issue some may see this as a positive as the device is smaller, lighter and probably has longer battery life. |
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Hobo
Joined: 23 Nov 2008
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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An App Store makes huge volumes possible wich in turn gives great pricing possibilities. People prefer to pay $3 for an app rather than $30 (obvious?). What's more. the $3 App Store app makes more money than the $30 one because of volume and so the developer spends more time on it ...
Also many reseller sites fiddle the figures eg 'Top Apps' on Handango are not the best selling apps, but the ones that make the most money. This drives prices upwards. An app store drives them downwards. |
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kieranEire
Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 282
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| Posted: Tue Jan 13, 2009 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | An App Store makes huge volumes possible wich in turn gives great pricing possibilities. People prefer to pay $3 for an app rather than $30 (obvious?). What's more. the $3 App Store app makes more money than the $30 one because of volume and so the developer spends more time on it ... |
This is purely based on the iphone app store and in reality things have not worked out this way.
For example see the top 20 app store applications at
http://www.apple.com/iphone/appstore/
Tetris at number 7 is $4.99, a unit converter $1.99 at number 6 in the business apps. What the iphones app store has done is created a plethora of applications such as iFart and sell them at $0.99. Motion x a gps compass and tracking $2.99, Geocaching $9.99. I could go on and on though what is fact is for example on windows mobile all this applications are available for free in some form.
The 'I am rich' application which told the purchaser he was too rich and stupid. It cost $999. This application uses the ease of purchasing to dupe customers in shelling out $999 for nothing.
Most of these cheap applications are just get rich quick schemes. We are now in the age of not just junk food but junk software.
Here is an interesting article.
http://www.losingfight.com/blog/2008/11/15/how-to-price-your-iphone-app-out-of-existence/
| Quote: | | Also many reseller sites fiddle the figures eg 'Top Apps' on Handango are not the best selling apps, but the ones that make the most money. This drives prices upwards. An app store drives them downwards. |
Maybe but at least you have the option of several resellers. Also have you heard of apples NDA or as its now know '%$^ing NDA' where developers are not allowed to share code, techniques or talk to journalists and blogs. How apple have the power to determine who's right or wrong in the iBeer and iPint controversy instead of the courts.
Are we really willing to give up the free market for what is effectively a monopoly? In the long run this cannot be good for the consumer or the developers. |
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Hobo
Joined: 23 Nov 2008
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:44 am Post subject: |
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Windows Mobile was exactly the same in the beginning; tonnes of tat for $2 etc. Give the AppStore a chance to settle down. The AppStore is a natural evolution.
Reasons why I love Apple's AppStore:
1. Monopoly? Great! Great for customers as they get lower prices, great for developers because most of the tedium is taken care of eg just one reseller to worry about. Apple only charge 30% commission including all DRM and signing. If you're a reseller then you can still make money by linking to app store apps, just don't expect the 40%+ that you were used to.
2. No piracy! I released a WM app a few years back that had 11000 downloads on a Warez site (a hacked version) compared to about 300 sales on Handango (at that point). Piracy is endemic when selling via resellers. One reason the AppStore makes so much money is that they sign/DRM your works. I was involved with MS for awhile and they know all about the few mega WM Warez sites but ... have done nothing ...
3. Choice of resellers? If you were a software house then you would know that there is no choice - you have to be with ALL of them and even then you get a fraction of the AppStore exposure. Then there is the issue of some resellers picking and chosing the apps they will take eg Handmark, and the difficulty of getting onto each of the Networks eg Orange, O2 etc. It's a nobrainer.
4. The AppStore is honest. If it says No1 then it's the bestseller. If something costs $1 and is better than a $100 app then as a customer I want to know, but a $100 app can sell one copy on Handango and be higher than a $1 that has sold 99 
5. New apps are not hidden away because they might take away sales from the best sellers.
6. Even playing field; your app is visible to everyone, just like your competitors apps. Compare this to Handango where you might be excluded from 'In Hand', or from the 'Certified for WM' category unless you pay out $500 minimum etc.
7. Good apps will likely make a profit. This is rarely true via the reseller route. Their combined exposure just isn't enough. How many big names code for WM? A few tried then disappeared. My guess is there will be lots of big names coding for the AppStore soon.
8. If developers don't make money then they lose interest / move platforms. The AppStore will lure and reward the best developers.
The Appstore is a godsend.
I used to go round record shops browsing through vinyl. Now I use iTunes. It's easy. It's better value. It's progress. The AppStore will do for software what iTunes did for music :0) |
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Hobo
Joined: 23 Nov 2008
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 1:04 am Post subject: |
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| PS That 'interesting article' is bollox, at least as far as I read. Complete bollox. I did what little Timmy from BigSoftCo did and it has made me wealthy and I'm still alive too. So long as you don't write crap, and so long as you have the ideas (i.e. you are not a one trick pony), and so long as you treat customers as valued human beings, then you have a good chance. The trick is to aim high and not just plagiarise. My apps are $4.99 which is more than enough. Sure if you write a flashlight app you wont get anywhere, but then why should you? If you have 5 to 20 good software ideas you'll do well. Maybe VERY well. And those original ideas will lead to others ... |
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zohaer21
Joined: 25 Aug 2005
Posts: 40
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:48 am Post subject: wmfanboy turned iphone fanboy |
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| Hobo wrote: | Windows Mobile was exactly the same in the beginning; tonnes of tat for $2 etc. Give the AppStore a chance to settle down. The AppStore is a natural evolution.
Reasons why I love Apple's AppStore:
1. Monopoly? Great! Great for customers as they get lower prices, great for developers because most of the tedium is taken care of eg just one reseller to worry about. Apple only charge 30% commission including all DRM and signing. If you're a reseller then you can still make money by linking to app store apps, just don't expect the 40%+ that you were used to.
2. No piracy! I released a WM app a few years back that had 11000 downloads on a Warez site (a hacked version) compared to about 300 sales on Handango (at that point). Piracy is endemic when selling via resellers. One reason the AppStore makes so much money is that they sign/DRM your works. I was involved with MS for awhile and they know all about the few mega WM Warez sites but ... have done nothing ...
3. Choice of resellers? If you were a software house then you would know that there is no choice - you have to be with ALL of them and even then you get a fraction of the AppStore exposure. Then there is the issue of some resellers picking and chosing the apps they will take eg Handmark, and the difficulty of getting onto each of the Networks eg Orange, O2 etc. It's a nobrainer.
4. The AppStore is honest. If it says No1 then it's the bestseller. If something costs $1 and is better than a $100 app then as a customer I want to know, but a $100 app can sell one copy on Handango and be higher than a $1 that has sold 99
5. New apps are not hidden away because they might take away sales from the best sellers.
6. Even playing field; your app is visible to everyone, just like your competitors apps. Compare this to Handango where you might be excluded from 'In Hand', or from the 'Certified for WM' category unless you pay out $500 minimum etc.
7. Good apps will likely make a profit. This is rarely true via the reseller route. Their combined exposure just isn't enough. How many big names code for WM? A few tried then disappeared. My guess is there will be lots of big names coding for the AppStore soon.
8. If developers don't make money then they lose interest / move platforms. The AppStore will lure and reward the best developers.
The Appstore is a godsend.
I used to go round record shops browsing through vinyl. Now I use iTunes. It's easy. It's better value. It's progress. The AppStore will do for software what iTunes did for music :0) |
plus the post below it...
i used to be on palm before about 10 yr ago then switched to wm for 8 yrs last year i swithced the iphone and appstore.. i wont go into details or argue here with any wmfanatic because what i want from a device may be different than why youve got yours (one simple example even opera and other 3rd party ie explorers on wm still cant hold a candle to iphones safari) and customer service of developers on appstore is simply outstanding.. i had a nokia n95 aswell and bought many softwares for it including docs to go , psiloc , killer gmbh softwares etc , when i changed my device to nokia n95 8gb and asked them go get another serial for their apps (with providing them scanned reciept of the handset purchase) many many of them asked additional money to get another serial number
you know what i did ..i used my nokia 8gb for another 6 months using Cracked apps of the stuff i had already bought !
even though piracy is there for iphone apps but the price is so attractive (0.99 to 5 dollars) that you dont mind paying money for something you really like ....that coupled with the iphone 3g specs and superior customer support by devs and all the ease you get out of itunes... thats the reason why appstore is godsend and apple should get a hats off salute for coming up with the idea and not only that but being able to IMPLEMENT that idea into what it is today |
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kieranEire
Joined: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 282
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| Posted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Windows Mobile was exactly the same in the beginning; tonnes of tat for $2 etc. Give the AppStore a chance to settle down. The AppStore is a natural evolution.
Reasons why I love Apple's AppStore:
1. Monopoly? Great! Great for customers as they get lower prices, great for developers because most of the tedium is taken care of eg just one reseller to worry about. Apple only charge 30% commission including all DRM and signing. If you're a reseller then you can still make money by linking to app store apps, just don't expect the 40%+ that you were used to. |
I have already shown this not necessarily to be the case using actual prices taken from app store. see my original post.
With monopoly comes censorship and we all know about the "duplicates existing functionality." clause. Effectively apple have censored applications without telling developers and only after developers put the effort into developing the application. This is clearly unethical and an example of apples abuse of their position. Yet Apple only look to have been banning applications duplicating the functionality of the Apple software on the iphone. Just look at how many soduku apps are there in the app store.
Many developers for the iphone have been so worried about Apples sensitive nature publications like Macworld have to guarentee anonymity before they will talk to them.
| Quote: | | 2. No piracy! I released a WM app a few years back that had 11000 downloads on a Warez site (a hacked version) compared to about 300 sales on Handango (at that point). Piracy is endemic when selling via resellers. One reason the AppStore makes so much money is that they sign/DRM your works. I was involved with MS for awhile and they know all about the few mega WM Warez sites but ... have done nothing ... |
Not true, the IPhone DRM has been cracked ages ago and cracked iphone software is widely available. Infact all the DRM has actually done is restricited people releasing software under GPL or similar licenses. Then of course we won't even go near what many iphone developers call the $%^ing NDA.
| Quote: | | 3. Choice of resellers? If you were a software house then you would know that there is no choice - you have to be with ALL of them and even then you get a fraction of the AppStore exposure. Then there is the issue of some resellers picking and chosing the apps they will take eg Handmark, and the difficulty of getting onto each of the Networks eg Orange, O2 etc. It's a nobrainer. |
I release software on several platforms including the iphone and this is not true. Its just as easy to get exposure as in the iphones app store. I sell all my software on my own web site directly and find it easy to get exposure. I have no percentage to pay and I can discuss my software development techniques openly developing a few partnership projects since. As for Appstore exposure the problem is iphone users are subjected to hords of junk software.
| Quote: | | 4. The AppStore is honest. If it says No1 then it's the bestseller. If something costs $1 and is better than a $100 app then as a customer I want to know, but a $100 app can sell one copy on Handango and be higher than a $1 that has sold 99 |
How honest is inventing a "duplicates existing functionality." clause after you developed your application.
| Quote: | | 5. New apps are not hidden away because they might take away sales from the best sellers. |
They are removed completely if they challenge the iphones software.
| Quote: | | 6. Even playing field; your app is visible to everyone, just like your competitors apps. Compare this to Handango where you might be excluded from 'In Hand', or from the 'Certified for WM' category unless you pay out $500 minimum etc. |
Again if your application challenges apples iphone software it is removed completely.
| Quote: | | 7. Good apps will likely make a profit. This is rarely true via the reseller route. Their combined exposure just isn't enough. How many big names code for WM? A few tried then disappeared. My guess is there will be lots of big names coding for the AppStore soon. |
Good apps make a profit on any platform. No big names will develop for appstore while the current restrictions stand. For example Tom Tom
| Quote: | | 8. If developers don't make money then they lose interest / move platforms. The AppStore will lure and reward the best developers. |
This can be said of any plaform.
| Quote: | The Appstore is a godsend.
I used to go round record shops browsing through vinyl. Now I use iTunes. It's easy. It's better value. It's progress. The AppStore will do for software what iTunes did for music :0) |
I have no problem with an app store per se. However to deny there are pitfalls, that software is cheaper, there is no piract and having just one method of purchasing software is not open to abuse is simply not true. The iphones app store has had all these problems.
A app store should only restrict illegal software, software that violates any license agreements or contracts (decisions should be left to the courts) and software that causes instability. The other restrictions are nothing other than apples abuse of their position. |
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